Tuesday, November 09, 2004


In politics, Jesus has evolved from being a niche market to being THE market. Somehow I don't think he's all that impressed. After all, he's been much more than that to quite a lot of us for about 2,000 years now.

To the youth vote, I don't know what to say. You had your chance? You were the belle of the ball in '04 but decided to go home alone before the party was over. That's not entirely fair, because you did show an interest and that's a beginning. Maybe it will pan out in '08. Either way, the VOTE OR DIE slogan will be taken from its figurative meaning in the Diddy campaign to a literal meaning in '08 by the far right.

I can see it now. "My sources have spoken to the Savior and he says, if you want to go to heaven, vote for me!" Maybe Alan Keyes was on to something after all. Oh, yeah...he got his butt kicked by the guy that Jesus doesn't like. Well, these aren't hard and fast rules.

So everyone is scrambling to understand what VALUES means. What are MORALS and where can I get them? Better yet, how can I sell them? Surveys are being put together, poll questions being analyzed and I'm sure at least a dozen new think tanks and PACS have been formed to put together the '06 congressional campaign strategies.

It's really simple folks and the first hint is, it's not about religion. It's about listening to people instead of telling them what you think they should know. It's about understanding that life on the coast is different than life everywhere else and those people living everywhere else wouldn't have it any other way. Does that make them right? Not about everything. Pushing fear and homophobia isn't anything resembling Christ, but if you try to understand where it comes from you'll be able to handle it better than if you just spit out how wrong it is.

As much as people want to say God doesn't belong here or there, he's still gonna be everywhere and unfortunately, people will take advantage of that and in a lot of places, it will work.

Okay, I take it back. It isn't simple, but if the Dems try and spend these next 3 years doing more listening than engaging in self-righteous blaming, it won't be the big surprise it was this year. They really can't afford that.


At 1:09 PM, Blogger mcorny said...

Your conspiracy theorists should really give it a rest. Bush got both the popular vote and the electoral college and won. Kerry conceded like a big boy so get on with your lives and start preparing for 2010.

At 7:49 PM, Blogger CleverCynic said...

As a conservative independant I think you guys are racking your collective brain for nothing. Yes a lot of Bush voters cited "moral values" as their reason for their vote. I think this is because it was the only thing even approximating the truth of the options given at the time. In fact if you combine Iraq and terrorism in one group, and economy, taxes, social security together (all economic), this moral values thing ends up quite low in the list.

The bottom line is that this election was an anomaly, unless the current circumstances persist. Throughout history most moderates could work reasonably well in a bipartisan fashion. I too was not very partisan as I became over the last 4 years. Historically mudslinging was confined to showing what someone did and spinning the outcome or where it would lead. This time however the ingredients were changed by Michael Moore. His new formula emerged that went a tier deeper into speculation, not just the whats, but the why's. The overall formula was to take every choice, imagine the worst possible motive for it, say it's that, and string a hundred of them together. Not that it was NEVER done before by whips and whatnot but I think people in general kind of knew to ignore that kind of stuff. The problem this time was that the dems embraced it and begain quoting it with hysterical wide-eyes at any given chance, and many people in their anger just started saying really ridiculous things like dictators are better and communism is good. This completely smeared you guys and you all became indistinguishable from one another because no one would stop the hemmoraging and denounce it. You were all united in your rage against basically one man, but not for all of the valid reasons that are subject to argument, but for a pack of speculative lies that places people in a position of having to prove a negative. Sure, we came back with our own if for nothing else but to show you how the formula works, but in the end everyone was completely sold on their own version as absolute truth. Nothing motivates people to fury like a pack of lies. If there was a speck of truth, it was squandered by not knowing where to quit and soaring over the top. The most impressionable age group in the country was taken advantage of and it's shameless. In the end, the vote came down to just one thing in everyone's mind: whether the US is the good guys or the bad guys. The dems embraced a new culture that forgot who we are, what it means to be an American, and how to have pride in that. The people of the villages of France and the people of villages of Nebraska I'm sure are equally nice, friendly, optimistic people, but face it, we like them but we're hardly in awe of Europe. Somehow in the end our differing approach to resources, ingenuity, and government have PRESERVED our world power status. What I mean by that is that they used to be as well but allowed the socialization of their countries, welfare states, unemployment rates 10% at minimum and more closely resembling our great depression. You have forgotten that bad news about the economy is only bad news to US in contrast to what we enjoy. Our worst day is coveted by all of these countries you all seem to want to approximate so badly. So in the end, upon exit polling, what do you pick of the choices presented?

As far as the religion thing goes, well, I'm agnostic so I don't really get the vibe you guys have been relying on. I'm a biochemist and can argue all day long how republicanism is the most logical approach to government, and while we both have our idiots, some of ours are only right by accident...pick on them all you want. I don't believe you have to believe in God to know that killing babies is wrong. In fact I believe abortion should be legal for ALL of the reasons you say you need them! Even then they would be less than a percent of what they are now. Yes, if you are raped, you should be filing criminal charges and then check the box at the bottom of the form "under the circumstances do you wish to opt for an abortion?" I'm not superstitious however, RU486 is fine, stem cell research hell yeah...I have no superstitions about a gram of cells. Why not consider all the bizarre requests that never seem to end? I remember when gays were getting their heads beat in with baseball bats and just wanted to be tolerated. I remember the argument that what they did behind closed doors was none of our business. I agreed with both. So what's this now? Abortion is some silly trick of medical science only even possible for a time now, and it's regarded like a tit job everytime someone gets caught in the moment and bumps uglies in the backseat. Conservative women don't tend to end up in these situations to begin with. So yes, moral values to an extent, just simply beginning with conduct. You guys make me nervous trying to figure out this religious crowd. I already hear the wheels turning, how do we do to them what we've done to the kids? If it's not authentic then drop it. There's plenty who don't believe, and when you do, you can't just ignore everything it has taught you. So it doesn't matter how religious either one of them said they are. One stands for the principles and the other is ambivalent about them. Religion aside, abortion is a valid controversy anyway... forget what Jesus said, does it strike you as moral or not..quit looking for a scapegoat. These girls don't walk out of those clinics with big f'in grins on their faces, it's devastating. Anyway, this isn't my salient issue, but either walk the walk or let it go and sell your "do whatever you want" message. As you say, we'll be overtaken by city girls and minorities in 50 years anyway. Ironically if you made abortion illegal you'd start winning a hell of a lot more elections a lot sooner anyway. And on our end, if people really wanted to eliminate gays, let them marry and eliminate the stigma. Since you're all so sold that it's genetic then the only possible way this gene is being carried on is by those forced into self-loathing breeding relationships to escape the wrath of society. Unfortunately family dysfunction will still continue to exist and you'll see there will be just as many gays no matter what. It's the same reason violence is NOT a gene, it's an impulse. Can't have it both ways. Again, behavior is the main issue, moral values is just the only thing approximating it, and the turnout heavily fueled by Moore.

Man I have 900 more pages in me but I gotta go... I'll check back. Read my initial blog for more if you really want to understand and at least know what you're ACTUALLY dealing with rather than speculation and ways to trick the system.

At 10:28 AM, Blogger akathebug said...

How do we jibe the moral values arguement with the following:
The Associated Press, using data supplied by the US Census Bureau, found that the highest divorce rates are to be found in the Bible Belt. The AP report stated that "the divorce rates in these conservative states are roughly 50 percent above the national average of 4.2 per thousand people." The 10 Southern states with some of the highest divorce rates were Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Mississippi, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, and Texas. By comparison nine states in the Northeast were among those with the lowest divorce rates: Connecticut, Massachusetts, Maine, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Vermont.

At 4:07 PM, Blogger CleverCynic said...

My first conclusion would be one that I would volunteer the same statistic had I been asked what I would think the rates WOULD be. People in the blue states are significantly less inclined to marry and more inclined to live together, and also more inclined to host gays who are not able to marry. Marriage of that sort is new in Massachussettes and I wouldn't expect any of them to divorce yet. I don't know that anyone said that gays would likely have high divorce rates, but I think its reasonable to assume that they all share the same value system and that infidelity would not be a reason they would cite as significant for a reason to divorce. I think women would probably not have an issue with this, but all men regardless of sexual preference are more inclined to cheat, and as a function of increased availability that is much less bounded in the gay community by their own admission.

But, I have not seen the study and am basing that on sheer numbers and not a true "rate" which would presuppose a true statistic of divorces divided by marriages with respect to population. As someone who is Agnostic, I do think its possible that religion forces people to marry earlier and without experience given their proclivity to not take others for test runs prior to marriage. I think this is the same pitfall of Catholic preachers denying their sexual humanity.

In any case, when republicans do bad things, they are falling short of their moral ideals. When democrats do it, they simply say we never said we were in the first place. And on a final note, I don't believe either side ever included divorce as a salient issue with respect to morals, so there is no real incentive to explain it away.

At 4:23 PM, Blogger CleverCynic said...

ACK! I completely left out the number one and most obvious reason. Though Republicans hold themselves to high ideals, they are subject to human mistakes as we all know, and when premarital pregnancy has occurred, are morally opposed to fixing this problem in the manner suitable for the democrats. This leads to that "shotgun" wedding stemming from the virtue that marriage provides the best environment for nurturing a family with children. This does not mean that these two people were a good fit or psychologically mature enough to venture into this responsibility.

The most objective shot we have at determining or understanding morals stems from the consequences of actions. I am not Jewish, but certainly the notion that pork rotted quickly was a good bit of intelligence to any who would listen. We of course solved this problem with technology and cooling systems, so something that was immoral by that standard certainly would not be now. Another is that sexual permiscuity of women would lead to underprivelaged and disadvantaged children. However, the way we have solved this problem is by taking something that was just a bad idea and correcting for it by what many see as outright murder. Certainly this cannot be the method by which sexual freedom becomes moral. However again, in the day of Roe Vs. Wade, there was definitely an argument in favor of it since people WERE in fact engaging heavily in this activity and the most high-tech solution was "pulling out". Now, however, we have the same technology that made eating pork now moral or acceptable by a multitude of contraceptives, and I believe it is now time to encourage those as the solution to this problem. Perhaps we can view this period of 50,000,000 + abortions as a terrible period in time while we made a painful transition to sexual freedom w/o the proper technology to make it ok.

If abortion were only legal now for each and every reason pro-choicers say they need it, certainly we could all live with that. And technology is such that even if you are going to sleep with a stranger this evening you can still be prepared.

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At 10:31 PM, Blogger Honnistaibe said...

You'all missed the whole point. The election was a defacto referendum on GW, nothing else...that's the one true major correlation between beliefs and voting. If Al Gore had been put up again he might have won..Kerry had too much baggage.

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